ARB'S - Needed or not? | The MOT Testers and AE's Forum

girlmechanik
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ARB'S - Needed or not? Jul 25, 2018 14:34:22 GMT 1

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Post by girlmechanik on Jul 25, 2018 14:34:22 GMT 1

Good afternoon,

Just a quick one for my mothers car. It's a 2001 Vauxhall Vectra - I suspect it has no anti roll bar on there atm. (Don't ask, long story). MOT is due pretty imminently, so need an answer about whether if it is supposed to have one, it has to have one? I know the old rules we good old "if it ain't there, I can't test it", but I know the rules have changed recently and have become really quite strict.

Please advise.

Many thanks,
Ruby

sniffer MOT tester Posts: 11 Class tested: 4 Last Online: Apr 7, 2021 6:35:39 GMT 1 Likes: 1	ARB'S - Needed or not? Jul 25, 2018 14:55:28 GMT 1 Back to Top Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top Post by sniffer on Jul 25, 2018 14:55:28 GMT 1 If one was fitted as standard, it has to be fitted or its a fail!

girlmechanik Default new > Posts: 3 Last Online: Jul 25, 2018 17:35:15 GMT 1	ARB'S - Needed or not? Jul 25, 2018 15:08:00 GMT 1 Back to Top Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top Post by girlmechanik on Jul 25, 2018 15:08:00 GMT 1 Jul 25, 2018 14:55:28 GMT 1 sniffer said: If one was fitted as standard, it has to be fitted or its a fail! Ah epic. Lets hope it's somewhere at home in the workshop then! Thank you.

castrolrob
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ARB'S - Needed or not? Jul 25, 2018 15:18:19 GMT 1

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Post by castrolrob on Jul 25, 2018 15:18:19 GMT 1

the old regs said if fitted as standard it needed to be there,this was to allow for some motors where in different vehicles in the same range some would have em others wouldn't(notably micra,early clio etc)and given there aint a Vectra built that didn't have front + rear rollbars I would expect it to be spotted!think the current wording is along the lines of unsafe modification but ill have to check next time im logging a car out

nitros44 MOT tester Posts: 3,804 Class tested: 4, 7 Last Online: Mar 6, 2013 1:09:15 GMT 1 Likes: 1,969	ARB'S - Needed or not? Jul 25, 2018 16:48:33 GMT 1 via mobile Back to Top Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top Post by nitros44 on Jul 25, 2018 16:48:33 GMT 1 Once again it’s not a modification . The anti roll bar is missing so the defect is “missing “ Section 5.3.3 a !! Dangerous
	I might not be the best,but i was always in the top one

castrolrob MOT tester Posts: 4,372 Class tested: 4, 7 Last Online: Apr 1, 2024 14:07:39 GMT 1 Likes: 2,763	ARB'S - Needed or not? Jul 25, 2018 16:53:00 GMT 1 Back to Top Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top Post by castrolrob on Jul 25, 2018 16:53:00 GMT 1 like I said I aint looked it up yet under the new regs so I aint sure but ill take your word for it

girlmechanik
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ARB'S - Needed or not? Jul 25, 2018 17:15:58 GMT 1

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Post by girlmechanik on Jul 25, 2018 17:15:58 GMT 1

Jul 25, 2018 16:48:33 GMT 1 nitros44 said:

Once again it’s not a modification .
The anti roll bar is missing so the defect is “missing “
Section 5.3.3 a !!
Dangerous

I haven't touched the car so it's not a modification. I'm taking over the care of the car, due to circumstances out of my control and simply asking a question. Although, I'd like to know how it is considered dangerous though?

lonewolf MOT tester MOT Tester Posts: 367 Class tested: 4, 5L, 7 Last Online: Apr 18, 2024 15:51:11 GMT 1 Likes: 240	ARB'S - Needed or not? Jul 25, 2018 17:25:24 GMT 1 ht likes this Back to Top Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top Post by lonewolf on Jul 25, 2018 17:25:24 GMT 1 Some would consider it dangerous as it has a negative impact on the directional stability of the vehicle. More so in the case of a Front anti roll bar

castrolrob
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ARB'S - Needed or not? Jul 25, 2018 17:35:55 GMT 1

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Post by castrolrob on Jul 25, 2018 17:35:55 GMT 1

Jul 25, 2018 17:15:58 GMT 1 girlmechanik said:

Jul 25, 2018 16:48:33 GMT 1 nitros44 said:

Once again it’s not a modification .
The anti roll bar is missing so the defect is “missing “
Section 5.3.3 a !!
Dangerous

I haven't touched the car so it's not a modification. I'm taking over the care of the car, due to circumstances out of my control and simply asking a question. Although, I'd like to know how it is considered dangerous though?

it started with a roll bar,now it aint got one.thats definitely a modification.whoever did it is irrelevant at that point.and yes just double checked rollbar missing is still a fail as per nitros post above.its down as dangerous cos that's how the ministry have worded that particular defect and it will automatically get printed off as such.we just press dem buttons (rofl)

the ministry provided the defect wording not us.

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ARB'S - Needed or not? Jul 26, 2018 9:48:27 GMT 1

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Post by David on Jul 26, 2018 9:48:27 GMT 1

Jul 25, 2018 17:35:55 GMT 1 castrolrob said:

Jul 25, 2018 17:15:58 GMT 1 girlmechanik said:

I haven't touched the car so it's not a modification. I'm taking over the care of the car, due to circumstances out of my control and simply asking a question. Although, I'd like to know how it is considered dangerous though?

it started with a roll bar,now it aint got one.thats definitely a modification.whoever did it is irrelevant at that point.and yes just double checked rollbar missing is still a fail as per nitros post above.its down as dangerous cos that's how the ministry have worded that particular defect and it will automatically get printed off as such.we just press dem buttons (rofl)

the ministry provided the defect wording not us.

We have to versions of Modified now,

12 Unsafe modification

Modifications to vehicles must be assessed on their merits, taking account of the nature of the modification and whether the component is critical to safety.

A modification is unsafe if it:

. adversely affects the roadworthiness of the vehicle
. is likely to cause injury, such as modification to the body
. has a disproportionately adverse effect on the environment

13 Extensively modified vehicles

If a vehicle has been extensively modified or converted, certain defects, such as for components ‘missing where fitted as standard’ shouldn't be applied, for example:

. a car converted for competition rally use must have the rear seats removed, be fitted with a roll cage and full
harness seat belts, may not be fitted with components such as brake servo, power steering or airbags
. a car converted to a stretch limousine may no longer be fitted with items such as curtain airbags or a functional
electronic stability control system

This exemption doesn’t apply to vehicles with minor modifications. Therefore, a car fitted with rally style seats, body kit and a sports steering wheel wouldn’t be exempt from the requirement to have a driver’s airbag if one was fitted as standard equipment.

Vehicles modified for disabled use must be assessed on their merits. For example, it's acceptable for the driver’s airbag to be removed for a wheelchair user, but the SRS warning lamp mustn't indicate a system malfunction.

Has to meet either of the above criteria to be Modified as Missing is a listed Defect for most suspension parts

It’s not that I’m so smart, it’s just that I stay with problems longer.
—Albert Einstein

castrolrob MOT tester Posts: 4,372 Class tested: 4, 7 Last Online: Apr 1, 2024 14:07:39 GMT 1 Likes: 2,763	ARB'S - Needed or not? Jul 28, 2018 13:38:56 GMT 1 Back to Top Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top Post by castrolrob on Jul 28, 2018 13:38:56 GMT 1 I was going by the dictionary definition of modified,ie changed from its original configuration

David Administrator Owner\Director, AE\NT\SM, DVSA VTS Council Member, Registered Member & Administrator of The MOT Testers & AE's Forum If the facts don't fit the theory, change the facts. Albert Einstein Posts: 6,711 Class tested: 4 Last Online: Apr 19, 2024 13:25:15 GMT 1 Likes: 963	ARB'S - Needed or not? Aug 3, 2018 13:35:15 GMT 1 Back to Top Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top Post by David on Aug 3, 2018 13:35:15 GMT 1 Jul 28, 2018 13:38:56 GMT 1 castrolrob said: I was going by the dictionary definition of modified,ie changed from its original configuration We now have our own brand new MOT definition of Modified mate
	It’s not that I’m so smart, it’s just that I stay with problems longer. —Albert Einstein

Dynamo
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ARB'S - Needed or not? Aug 5, 2018 21:27:45 GMT 1

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Post by Dynamo on Aug 5, 2018 21:27:45 GMT 1

Going back a bit now in time but I seem to remember some Renault I once tested had no front anti-roll bar fitted, I picked up the phone and spoke to the dealer parts department at the time, the reply came back, if it ain't got ABS fitted then it don't need an anti-roll bar. So how does one then decide a vehicle is dangerous to drive when a roll bar is missing, if some vehicles can have them not fitted in the first place from the factory, be road legal and safe! The mind boggles.

You can't "unbreak" the broken,you can only break the unbroken to break the break of the unbroken, for me, you cannot unbreak me, for I am already broken,so you have no need to break the break because I am not unbroken.

aylesburyjock
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ARB'S - Needed or not? Aug 6, 2018 7:03:32 GMT 1 ivor likes this

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Post by aylesburyjock on Aug 6, 2018 7:03:32 GMT 1

You don't have to decide if it's dangerous, you have to decide do you think it was fitted with the anti roll bar when new? I had the same experience as you; it was with a renault clio. You will just have to inspect the sites where it would be mounted and decide whether or not it looks as if it ever had one. Then if you're not sure, you know the drill, benefit of the doubt etc.

Last Edit: Aug 6, 2018 7:04:14 GMT 1 by aylesburyjock -

castrolrob
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ARB'S - Needed or not? Aug 6, 2018 10:12:53 GMT 1

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Post by castrolrob on Aug 6, 2018 10:12:53 GMT 1

yup had the same with the same motor,only difference was id failed it on a rollbar link and it came back for retest with no rollbar!just how stupid do you think we are?another(yet again clio)I failed it on subframe and it came back with a boneyard subframe complete with bottom arms etc but a non rollbar model,that one id advised rollbar links so I knew it had had one to start with,ended in a shouting match with the punter that only ended when I rang Renaults to confirm it.gotta be years since ive used that rfr......

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ARB'S - Needed or not?

Post by girlmechanik on Jul 25, 2018 14:34:22 GMT 1

Post by sniffer on Jul 25, 2018 14:55:28 GMT 1

Post by girlmechanik on Jul 25, 2018 15:08:00 GMT 1

Post by castrolrob on Jul 25, 2018 15:18:19 GMT 1

Post by nitros44 on Jul 25, 2018 16:48:33 GMT 1

Post by castrolrob on Jul 25, 2018 16:53:00 GMT 1

Post by girlmechanik on Jul 25, 2018 17:15:58 GMT 1

Post by lonewolf on Jul 25, 2018 17:25:24 GMT 1

Post by castrolrob on Jul 25, 2018 17:35:55 GMT 1

Post by David on Jul 26, 2018 9:48:27 GMT 1

Post by castrolrob on Jul 28, 2018 13:38:56 GMT 1

Post by David on Aug 3, 2018 13:35:15 GMT 1

Post by Dynamo on Aug 5, 2018 21:27:45 GMT 1

Post by aylesburyjock on Aug 6, 2018 7:03:32 GMT 1

Post by castrolrob on Aug 6, 2018 10:12:53 GMT 1